Living in the Prophetic with Jonathan Pettitt
When I just revel in the grace and the mercy and the goodness and the greatness of our God in conversations that are taking place without a true expectation of where it's going to go. Sure, there might be some constructs to how we build the podcast or the way the interview works, but ultimately we just steward His Spirit. We just want to have the mic and our mouth yield to what He wants from it, and so today you are going to hear from a prophet. A prophet is a man of God, somebody who can hear from the Lord and can speak wisdom and truth into your life, and Jonathan Pettitt actually teaches us how to practice.
I'm calling you out - yes, you who is listening right now. You are worthy. You are redeemed. You are anointed. You are called by the grace of God to stand in the truth.
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A worship leader, speaker, teacher, and prophetic voice, Jonathan lives to see the Kingdom of God established and expanded in the Earth, and to see a lost world come to know the "compassionate, gracious, slow-to-anger, and abounding in love and forgiveness" God!
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Show Notes: Living in the Prophetic
Wow on more. Wow. I don't know how many episodes actually start by just saying, wow, but when I just revel in the grace and the mercy and the goodness and the greatness of our God in conversations that are just taking place without true expectation of where it's going to go. Sure. There might be some constructs to how we build the podcast or the way the interview works.
But ultimately we just steward his spirit. We just want to have the mic and our mouth yield to what he wants from it. And so you're in store today to hear from a prophet, right? And, and a prophet is a man of God, somebody who can hear from the Lord and can speak wisdom and truth into your life. And he actually teaches us how to practice.
He's actually in a training to teach us to continue to train, right? Because as a prophet, as an apostle, as a visionary, as any sort of gifted, talented human, and that is you, I'm calling out you. Yes, you who is listening right now. You are worthy. You are deemed, you are anointed. You are called by the grace of God to stand in the truth.
Doroty and to know that you're in training allows you to continue to be what he called my word to everyone's word. If they know the truth of their being of their nature, of the way God works, surrendered, or you surrendered friend, if not today, this conversation with the one and only Jonathan Pettit, a worshiper, a prophet, a speaker, a teacher, a man of God, a soon to be podcasters.
So you've got to take a look for him and stay tuned for his incredible sound. It truly is one of heaven, Jonathan. I love you brother. Thanks for.
Welcome to the fit and faith podcast. It is an acronym representing founders, innovators, and trailblazers who are looking to live a life fully, fully, authentically, and truly fit a space for us to connect on the raw real stories of mind, body, and soul alignment of entrepreneurs in kingdom. I'm your host, Tamra and dress.
And this podcast, isn't like the cookie cutter interview experience. I've been coined the entrepreneurial rabbi. And so we do go there unscripted, no matter how far wide, deep or high there is. My desire is to see people rise from the inside, out, into their greatest calling, by sharing their truest stories, talents and tips as a purpose activator and brand builder.
I believe our successes and failures are derived from who and whose we are not what we do. Strategy and vision are equally as important to the mission. So let's cut to the chase together and get fit in faith,
man. Oh man, you guys are in for a, such a tree today. I am so excited and humbly honored to introduce you to my dear friend, Jonathan. If you guys have not had the opportunity to meet him, you're going to leave forever changed at a multitude of ways. Not to add pressure on you, Jonathan, because of the gifting and natural anointing on your life, on your ability to speak into people, to teach people, to steward people's hearts and to ultimately connect them to the love of the father, which we both just to sand beneath, as children, as brothers and sisters.
And I've been so, um, grateful to know you over the course of the last few years and to pop your podcast, cherry, this is really fun. Welcome to the podcast. This is my first one. So which is so perplexing to me because you guys wait till you hear him. The stage a lot, most Sundays of his life, it's been associated to leading worship and teaching.
And so, um, he's going to do that for us here today. Uh, maybe not the leading worship part, but Hey, anything can happen on the Fitbit bond guests never know. So I'm, I'm just excited for people to get to know you in the way that I know you and for us to just dive deep in that space, we've already got some live listeners welcomes, all of those who were here with us live and listening later.
So Jonathan, let's jump into the conversation and maybe you'll teach me some things about you that I don't often know. I think that's one of the coolest things about the show is I get to explore and in the process of co-creating. I learned so much. And I always tell people, I come with a heart to be convicted, which is bizarre, but also an opportunity for iron sharpening iron.
And you do that for me often. So let's go back to young David, Jonathan, and talk us through kind of the evolution of how did you, uh, unlock this, this knowing and this deep love for the Lord and, and who was like kind of mentors along the way as you did that. Uh, well, first of all, uh, I just had to say, like, I feel like I'm in the big leagues now.
Um, I remember when I, um, when I, uh, preached at my church the first time, about four or five years ago, and I was like, okay, I've made it. Like I could go preach other places, but when they ask you to preach in your own home church, then, then you know, you've made it. And I feel like the, say I have that same feeling this morning, like your.
You're like the I've I've told you this before, you're the entrepreneur entrepreneurial rabbis. So sitting here with you today is a big deal for me. So yeah, for those of you guys who have heard me say that this is the man, the myth, the myth, the legend that it came from in a coffee shop right here in Virginia Beach.
So, uh, that, that's such a, like, it's a part of my bio now. I honestly talk about it because. It's something I had to explore. I didn't even really truly know what it meant. And, and as I've come deeper into relationship with you, just, even since that conversation, um, it's just been such a gift. So I think for that, absolutely.
And I just had to say, I have to take a couple of people. I have to thank my hairdryer, my flat art, because I'm having a really good hair day today. Really. And I actually like shaved my beard today because you saw me on Sunday was looking rough. So I trimmed it up this morning. So just everybody should be thankful for that.
So, no, but, um, my early years I tell people that, um, I have been in church since conception. Um, I was in the, uh, I mean, I feel like I got saved before I was born, but you know, I have a rich history in, um, the prophetic, the kingdom. Um, we were in church, um, all the time. I have two other brothers on the middle child, which I don't know if you knew that, but that probably explains a lot about me.
I'm a little kid come on. Middle children rule. Come on. Yeah, absolutely. Maybe that's why we connect so well, so one of the reasons, but I like tell people all the time that if there was a quota. It into heaven for how much you had to go to church. We have met that quota by like 12 or 13. So, um, we were in church all the time.
Um, I got saved when I was four and baptized in the holy spirit a week later. And, um, but even before I was born, my parents, we, um, they would go down. Um, we went to a pretty Pentecostal church and it was pretty diverse. And, um, but my mom and dad, I was born in Peoria, Illinois, the hometown of Richard Pryor.
And, um, but my parents had a really high core value for diversity and love of all people and actually my godmother and godfather, um, And I was babysat by their kids. Um, and they would drive down to St. Louis, which is about a two hour, two and a half hour drive. And they would drive down with, um, other people from different churches, white churches, black churches, down to St.
Louis for revival meetings at a black, black churches. And they did that two or three years, the first one year when I was still in the womb. And then the next year when I was born and both years, one year and apostle called my mom out when I was still in utero and called her out and gave her a prophetic word over me.
And then the next year a prophet called her out and gave her a prophetic word over me that. To be a prophet and that I'd be a prophetic voice to my generation. And then I got saved when I was four and felt the holy spirit at about a week later. And, um, so yeah, so my parents and my parents were like my spiritual, they were my physical parents, but my spiritual parents as well, they were really, um, really heavy into the word of faith movement, um, which gets a bad rap, you know, um, because of some of the things that.
The direction that it's gone in the past 30 or 40 years, but the origins of it were very highly biblical, very much about just believing God and, and declaring, speaking things that are not a lot of what we see now, when we talk about manifesting things and we talk about activating things, it's just biblical, it's taken from the apostle Paul, where he says that we look not to what is temporal, but to things that are eternal, because the things that are eternal are the things that are temporal are subject to change.
Uh, but, and he says, speak things that are not as though they are. And you look at people all the time talking about manifesting now. Right. And that's all it is. You're just, you're just manifesting. You're taking a biblical principle and you're using it in a non. Non-religious way. Um, but the thing, the fact of the matter is, is that you can take those principles and they'll work any place.
It doesn't matter because God created everything. And so, so anyway, um, I was in church my whole life. My parents were my, my teachers. I tell people all the time, like I was force fed. The Bible was like the vegetables for me. Like they were, they force fed us the scriptures. And at the time at a time I couldn't stand it.
I was just like, oh my gosh, we've got to memorize more scripture. Like what in the world? And, um, and now I have conversations with people that are like, where did you go to seminary? My kitchen table, Bible college. Like that's pretty much like, and honestly, like I learned, uh, even, and even when my older brother went to school, like his, his fellow students, his fellow Bible students hated him because he completely ruined the curve and he didn't study for any of this stuff.
He's like, I learned this when I was 10 years old, like what's what is y'all's problem? So that's the kind of history and, and not just the scriptures. We had, my parents have a rich history in the spirit and the prophetic. Uh, my dad's a prophet. Um, my mom is probably in my opinion, the most discerning person I've ever met in my life.
She can walk into a room and she's like, ah, something's not right here. You know, or look at somebody and say, I don't know, what's I don't know what's going on with that person, but something's not right. And nine times out of 10 she's. Right. And so just watching them, seeing how they interacted with people, learning how to watching them minister to people.
They were the head of the ultra ministry team. They were the head of our, um, our like inner healing ministry at harvest for awhile. And, um, and just, just watching them, uh, do life. Um, our family wasn't perfect, uh, by any stretch of the imagination. Good Lord. I'm not going to sit here and lie to you about that, but, um, when I look back on it, it, um, my parents were really the main, like the, the initial, um, the initial rabbis in my life.
If you want to put it down, Wow. I don't think at least from the people that I know that that is not generally speaking the traditional, uh, I think we're surrounded by some incredible people who have been born and raised into the faith and into, um, the examples that have been led. I mean, I could think of some of our best friends, Jay Anthony, right?
Like PK kids, they're pastors, kids. Um, but I didn't even know what Pentecostal, what that even meant until I was nearly in my thirties. And so, um, I believe that like denomination in and of itself has developed such a massive treasure inside of my life for so many different reasons. Um, and, and yet it does have, I hear some feedback, Josh.
I don't know if it's hold on. There we go and I meet as I'm talking. Um, but this, this understanding that when you're actually having these experiences, that it could happen so early in life, it can happen so late in life. And even when I was pregnant, I already had my kiddos. I was not really in the relational faith and knowing of God that I am now, I was the, probably the church religious Christian that you're used to.
It's this knowing that there is more, and for somebody, especially from a spiritual father and spiritual mother realm, to mentor you in that to experience and open the word of God and to speak in tongue or prophetic or vision and all of these different pieces that were completely new information to me when I started to really unpack my faith, um, and have that at a young age, which we're now courting our children through is, is such a magnificent gift in and of itself.
Yeah. Um, can you still hear me? Okay. Um, I switched to my AirPods, hoping that old get the, the ring out of it. Um, yeah. Um, the thing is, is that, um, I think there's so many, there were so many amazing things about being raised in a spirit-filled house. Um, but there were, I mean, you know, being, you know, speaking in tongues, which, I mean, I'm in the process of writing a book about that, the importance of that, um, uh, but just, just the move of the spirit and, and the, the sad thing is, is that I've seen, I've seen everything.
I just turned 45 on Christmas day. And so it's been 41 years with the Lord and I've seen pretty much everything you can see. I've seen the glorious parts of Pentecostal charismatic churches, and then I've seen like the really damaging parts of it, like. What, like, what are you guys doing? Like, what are we doing?
Like why it's laughable because it's not laughable. Really. It is, it's a, there's definitely a shame component to it. But it's this knowing that God is redemptive, um, that keeps us hope filled right in faith towards it. But it's much it's, it's flesh trying to control something that is uncontrollable. Um, and, and I think speaking in the realm of prophetic, that's another conversation in the same means in the same kind of dynamic, because I think he try and there's, there's some people here alive who were saying that this is new information.
Prophetic is just something they've newly been exploring. And I think it's important for our listeners to understand this too, cause we haven't actually ever had. What I would deem, like we've had people who have prophetic gifting, but not like a true prophet. Like you said about your father that I believe you are, that it was actually prophesied that that's a, you would become and be, um, and so I want people to understand it and it not feel like fear based or.
Right. The prophetic. Um, yeah. Well, this is the, um, I have to go back just a little bit. Um, because in the Pentecostal church, there was so much, um, excess about like legalism and, uh, there was so much fear at times, uh, of the prophetic where a prophet would come in. And, um, if we, and you and I have talked about this before, um, in Exodus, in the book of Exodus, when Moses goes on top of the mountain and he S and he says to the Lord, he says, Lord, show me your glory.
And God pretty much said. You know, let, let's slow your roll there. Moses. Like everybody wants to see the glory and God doesn't tell him, no, God does it in a lot of senses. When you ask God for something, he doesn't necessarily tell you no, but he gives you his best and he gives you what he gives you something better than what you're asking for.
And so God doesn't, he says, no, man can see my face and live. But what I am going to do for you is I'm going to make all of my goodness pass before you. And I'm going to declare my name, the Lord to you. And so what he does is, is he, he puts him in the cleft of the rock and then he let he passes by him and he lets all of his goodness pass before him.
And then God says, and then he says, I'm going to declare my name, the Lord. And my name, the Lord is the Lord merciful, compassionate, gracious, slow to anger, abounding in love and forgiveness. So he's the merciful, compassionate, slow to anger and abounding in love and forgiveness Scott and for the, for the Jews that was called what was called the disposition of Messiah and all throughout scripture from that first encounter with the Lord, with, from, with Moses, um, you see it all throughout the scriptures.
You see, you know, even at the dedication of Solomon's temple, where they said for the Lord is good and his mercy endorsed. Uh, David in Psalm 23, goodness and mercy will follow me all the days of my life. And, and then you see it, even in the new Testament, you see it all throughout the new Testament about the goodness and faithfulness of God that he's merciful, compassionate, gracious, slow to anger.
And so it was called the disposition of Messiah. So getting back to the prophetic in the first century church, what they would have when, uh, someone would come to give a prophecy is they would have, what's called the bench of three, and it would be three guys up on, up on this race platform. And it would be like, uh, an apostle and two prophets or two prophets or two apostles and a profit.
And what would happen is the per the prophet would come or the person would come and they would give the prophetic word. But no matter if the word was 100% accurate, if it wasn't given in a merciful, compassionate, gracious, slow to anger and above, and that I'm abounding in love and forgiveness manner, then it was considered to be falsed.
They were considered a false prophet because God is way more concerned than the information than you give than the heart that you give it in. Wow. That's how so many people have been damaged by the prophetic and been turned off from the prophetic, because they've seen people give prophetic words that are not within given in the disposition.
They've been, they've seen people come in and they've seen profits come in who have a hot, like, can literally see, oh, you've been sleeping with, you've been sleeping with another man's wife. And instead of it says, love, covers a multitude of sins. It doesn't say that it covers up. It just says that it covers.
And instead of pointing that out in front of an entire congregation, what should have happened is they should have been pulled aside or had that person should have gotten into a relationship with them and said, this is what the Lord said. And given it in a manner that is correcting, but also life-giving and not shame-based.
And so, um, my, and the thing is, is it, doesn't just, it doesn't just pertain to the prophetic in the first century church, everything had to be done in the disposition of Messiah, whether you were serving people, whether you were praying for healing, whether you were talking to people about, you know, being a witness for the Lord, everything had to be done in a merciful, compassionate, slow to anger and abounding in love and forgiveness manner.
Otherwise it's not the heart of the father. And so that's why so much of my, of what God has called me to is not just to evangelize, um, the world, but to really evangelize the church because it wasn't until I was about third 29 or 30 years old that I learned about the kingdom and the kingdom is way, way, way different than the church.
Um, the church. The church is the governmental organism of the kingdom. The church is not the end goal of what Jesus came for. Jesus, Jesus has main message. Was the kingdom. That's all he preached about was the kingdom of God. And, and the greatest, I mean, he said, uh, at one point that, um, that until John, till from the days of John the Baptist, until now the kingdom of God has been preached and the kingdom of God suffers violence and the violent take it by force.
And we use that scripture for spiritual warfare, but it's actually not for that. The actual literal literal translation of that is the kingdom of God suffers from a great pressing in, and everyone is trying to get in. So the great, the greatest church. Model you can have is just to demonstrate and declare the kingdom of God.
And if you do that, people will literally burn the doors of the church down to get in. There are so many pieces to that that I want to unpack. One of the first things that you were talking about in the component of how, uh, to, to deliver the prophetic and, and in the character, uh, annointing right. Of, of how he displays it.
It made me think of Jesus at the well and how she did everything that she was doing, but he didn't call out that as her identity. He called her out as woman. He called her out in her truest identity. And so it's no different. And I think we can utilize this more often when people go to point fingers at someone and they're calling out the worst in them.
And this is whether you're in the prophetic anointing or not, this is just her going to work and you see something that's wrong and you're pointing at it and be like, you're alive. Well, that's really not kind one because it's not coming from a gentle perspective. It's not coming from a correctional opportunity and you're taking what could have been an amazing iron sharpens iron experience.
And you're now down casting them into shame, guilt, regret, all of these things that are not from the father. And so I think one of the strategic things, whether you're yearning for the prophetic anointing, which is something that I really lean into, I've been studying for like five or six years this morning.
I was actually just talking about it on my Peloton preach that I do. And I'm going to, and I was, I was leaning into the fact that this is something I've yearned for for years. And I think it's something that we have to cultivate in the midst, right? Like while it's an anointing and a gift, there's also components, uh, and desire.
And as we yearn for the Lord, he will allow us to step into these greater giftings. But I would not be able to do that. If one, I didn't understand the identity and character of God, which has been a pursuit over the last seven years. If I wasn't able to stand in integrity with who he calls me to be, and also to be able to have the eyes, the empathetic eyes of the Lord to be.
Serve something. And that sweetness, like you said, that graciousness, when you serve something that is really heavy, oftentimes iron sharpening iron, that's not like a soft scenario, but it has to be that grace, mercy and love associated to it. So I just want to encourage people that this is a methodology of principle of life.
It's not a methodology, real principle of prophethood or being prophet. Yeah. And, and, and, and speaking to that, just a, just a practical example, like what, what happens? What do you do if you are ministering and. Like all of a sudden, you see someone's like living in a morality. What do you do? Obviously that's been shown to your, you seen that for a reason.
And so how I respond to it is, um, that obviously means because the places that you are attacked by the enemy are the greatest places that the enemy knows that you're going to have victory over him. That that's your destiny. That's what that's your purpose in life is to destroy those areas in the, in the powers, in the power of darkness, those are the areas that he knows that you were purposed for.
And so that's why he comes after you in those places. And so if someone was living in immorality, I would just look at the person and be like, man, you are such a man of few. You are. And going back to that speaking things that are not as though they are cause that's what the prophetic is. It is, it is foretelling and it's, forthtelling foretelling means that it's it's, um, you're, you're saying what's going to happen in the future, but forthtelling actually means that you actually speak it and make it happen.
And so if, if I, it's not about digging up dirt, it's about finding the golden people. And so, so we're not in the prophetic, we're not looking to dig up dirt on people. And so much of the prophetic in the past has been about that because we've had people that don't understand the character and nature of God.
And they're wounded people. They're wounded, they're wounded little kids in the, in the spirit emotionally. And when you're, when you have emotional wounds, then you start prophesying from your soul and from those wounds and then your profit sign from a place of shame, you're prophesied from a place of condemnation.
And you're not calling people caught, not calling things that are not as though they are. And so that's just a practical thing. If you ever see anything negative on somebody and you're not in relationship with them prophesied the proper side of the. Just that. I mean, it's just a simple thing. You don't have to get a word from the Lord.
If, if you, like, if you even feel that in your heart, like, oh, this person's dealing with this, don't make accusations, man. I, you know, I, you're such a man of purity. You're such a man of integrity. You're such a woman of godliness and just modesty and just innocence, you know? Um, and you would not believe how that literally the stories that I've heard from people and heard from other profits that when you do that, it literally changes the course of someone's life.
I think a thousand percent that this is so accurate on so many levels. I know it to be true. Um, it's something that where whether or not my husband knew that he was doing it. He actually called out in me during a season telling me that I was a woman of integrity. I love your integrity. He would never in our entire relationship.
I think to that point, we'd been together for seven years. He had never said this word to me and he just kept calling it out on me. I see me and it'd be the most bizarre things that he would say and penetrate to the sockets of my soul, because it was the opposite, right? It was the juxtaposition of how I was acting and therefore it wasn't him having to be like calling me any names, having to force feed, having to be angry over.
He literally was exampling the way that Jesus showed up in so many scenarios and how God the father and the old Testament did that with Moses. And, and it, it helped me create clarity over my identity. And I don't know that that's the word that I would have used at the time. I would have said you're annoying.
it's the only reason I would get agitated by it is because ashes, patient provokes change. Absolutely had to take it by something that is good and whole and pure it's because you're being called out to stand in that space, whether it's relational, whether it's emotionally. Um, for me, my mind was a massive part of my battlefield.
And now having a sound mind, the power love, and a sound mind, it's a promise from God that I can stand in that anointing and be able to help other people create clarity in the Headspace. That is a conduit from God. You can't hear God if you're muddied in this space. And so that's one area that I think everyone.
And when we talk about mindset and personal development and all of these places that these gurus and personal self-help people are saying. It is very powerful there. One nugget away from the truest unlock and that truest unlock is connecting people to God. Once they get that clarity, once they have that breakthrough, once they have control over their mind, it's still not going to serve them to the same caliber as if God were in the replacement of that chaos.
Yeah. Yeah. And it's, it's really amazing. My, my, um, when you, when you're talking about like, um, mental, you know, coaches and emotional coaches, and so many of those people are so much closer to the kingdom than they realize, like so close, like, uh, I mean even like, if you look at the scripture. So much of the scriptures, like we have made the church and the, what I call the machine.
When I say the machine I'm talking about, um, the church in its worst form, you know, where you just, it just chews people up and spits them out. Yeah. And so what the machine has done is it has, um, made everything so religious and it's drawn this horrible line between sacred and secular. We're in a Jewish mindset for Jesus.
There's no such thing as sacred and secular. Everything is sacred. Everything that you do is sacred, and that's why he said, whatever you do do it as under the, you, Paul said, whatever you do do it as unto the Lord, because everything you do is sacred. And so, uh, and God made everything like, God, Jesus, it's it says in the scriptures that there's nothing that was made, that was made without the word.
And Jesus is the word. And so there are so many things that you look at, um, that people like, oh, well, we can't talk about that. Cause that's new age. And I'm like, okay, well, who created everything? This is literally minutes before we went on this podcast. I got a text from somebody that I love, who said that she has been always, um, di diminishing the power of meditation.
And that is a conversation that's constantly happening. You should meditate all these things. And she was really into her health and wellness, and she has always negated it because she felt like it was new agey or whew. And she remembered as she's exploring her, what does she want in 2022? And that health and wellness is a huge part of it.
As she ages, she remembered that I had mentioned meditation before through my book or my podcast or one of the things. And y'all the word manifestation, the word meditation. It's biblically rooted. It's an example by which the father gave us to have a sound mind to retreat and get connected to him again.
And so everything that the world has secularized. You have to go back to the root. You have to go back to the root understanding of the word. You have to go back to the root practice of the, of the concept because he don't it's, it's all muddied. It's all been destroyed because the flesh we are, we have sinless nature.
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Let's do it. Yeah. And, and I will say this, that there are like, God made everything. So even meditation, you know, um, Hindus and Buddhists, they meditate, they use mantras and stuff like that, but literally all they did, like everything that new age people do, they just stole our stuff. Like they just literally took the stuff that we were scared of and they're using our stuff, you know?
And so, um, I absolutely what you said, go back to the biblical root of it and use it properly. But even stuff like people like, oh, trans and dental, or a trans relocation, where you go from one place to another, Phillip did that, like he's, it says he was with Ethiopian unit. And then at one, at one moment he was there.
And then another moment he was another, another place. It's it's biblical stuff. The enemy can, the devil can only take what God had made and pervert it. That's all he can do. He has no crematorial power. All we can do is take what the devil of the Lord, the Lord made and, and steal it and pervert it. But if you look going back to what I was saying before I got off track, um, if you look at the scriptures, there are so many scriptures that say, this is what it is to know God like in the old Testament.
And I think it's Micah. Um, uh, no, no, it's in Jeremiah. It says, um, to defend the oppressed and the orphan and to take up the cause of the oppressed, is this not what it is to know God, and, and then the scripture that says, uh, to do justly, to love mercy, to walk humbly with your God who has shown you. Oh man, what is good?
And what the what's the Lord acquire? Do justly, love justice, love mercy, and walk humbly with. And then in the new Testament, it says, um, uh, beloved, let us love one another for love comes from God and everyone who loves is born of God and knows God, he loves not doesn't know God for God is love. So what is it?
What is it to know? God it's to love one another. And so if we don't have this, um, thing of the pure and unadulterated religion, like Paul talks about of defending the orphan and the widow and being undefiled by, by the world, um, if we don't have that heart and understand that that is the heart of God loving one, another taking up the, uh, taking up the cars of the oppressed and the orphan and the widow and the poor and, and, and calling out the golden, finding the golden, calling that out in people.
If we don't have that heart, then the prophetic is just nothing. But with. Wow. Wow. And it's this understanding that, you know, people are in this search for purpose and ultimately they're in a search for identity. And ultimately they're in a search for love because at the root of all things is that we just want to be loved and we yearn for it so deeply from the moment you're conceived to the moment you come out to your time right here today.
And there's, there's research about how many times a day we should be hugged, right? Like 12 hugs a day. I don't know about you, but unless it's just my children, how you need, like repetitively in that moment, I'm not getting 12 hugs a day. And especially when there's quarantine and especially when there's things going on in the world where you're like, I'm good, I'll stay inside my bubble.
And so we have to recognize that that deep yearning, we can sense that hug that blanket, that, that spirit filled experience. If we're seeking him. And it's not just a fleshly manner that our needs are met, he does it on a spiritual realm so that we can go out and make disciples and showcase the character of God because it's implanted in.
Right. Yeah. And, and, and I mean, I was just thinking about what you're saying 12 hugs a day. That's just for normal people. If you're a physical touch person, times that, oh my gosh, I'm a, I'm a words of affirmation first and physical touch. And this core team has been killing me like, oh my gosh, man. But you're absolutely right.
You know, um, this whole thing, I've, I've been really as a prophet it's it's, um, it, it, I feel like there's a mandate on my life and it's kind of started to be fleshed out in the last year. And I think you and I have talked about this, just one of the things of, uh, the mandates of my life is just to be a, um, a kingdom chiropractor just to bring alignment to the church.
Because I, I feel like there are things that we preach that. We're like two or three degrees off. I mean, it sounds good, but we're not getting, we're not like we're not getting it. We're not getting the results that we should. And we're spinning our wheels like crazy, you know, and not just like a chiropractor of a spine, but I look at it and you and I have talked about this before, uh, actually have the, like a bicycle tire, like a wheel, actually, like the church's like a bicycle wheel that is bent out of shape and all these spokes are going all these different directions and we need to, we need to straighten the wheel out so that the amount of effort that we're putting forth is actually going to create the amount of return on investment, because we're not getting a whole lot of return on investment right now.
And so much of what we're doing right now that I see in the church that just breaks my heart is we're the churches so loud. We're just so loud in society. We're so loud about the things that are wrong in society. And we're so quiet in love. We're so silent in love and compassion, uh, when it comes to things that really matter.
Um, and we, we look at people and we're like, this is what's wrong with society. And this is what says, you know, this, this, this, and this. And we completely ignore everything. That's wrong with the church. And the, and the world looks at us and goes, how about you take care of your own house first? And why would anybody want to be a part of our, like of, of the kingdom?
If all they see is a shooting, each other that brokenness, like, I don't want to walk into the house that tumultuous Thanksgiving or Christmas dinner. I'm like, I'm good. I'll stay in the comfort of my own house. But if we can just like, if we can just start with being. Like just be kind, don't talk about Jesus.
Don't, don't talk about the things of the spirit. How about we just get back to the basics, like be kind like a couple of months ago, my pastor was preaching and it was a phenomenal message. And he said, and I feel like God wants us to take our, um, our walk with him to the next level and just take it to the next level and just walking kindness towards each other.
And that hit me like a ton of bricks, because what he was saying was absolutely true, but it was an absolute unintended indictment on the, on the church because it's the next level of walking with our, our walk with God is walking in kindness. How far have we fallen? Like kindness? What loving kindness is the kindergarten of the.
Then how immature are we? And so, and so that for me is just like we over spiritualize, all of these things that we have, the services that we do, the worship that we do. And it's like, no, John said, if you don't love one another, then you don't know God. And, and it, and it goes, it goes back to something I think you, and I've talked about before that God has placed a part of him in each one of us.
And we can't, we can't stand before the Lord and say, what, when we stand before him, we can't say, oh, well, I loved you. And he's like, I knew you. And he's like, uh, yeah, you, I don't think so. Like, it even says in the scriptures, when he separates the sheep and the goats, there's a litmus test. When I was naked, you clothed me when I was thirsty.
You gave me something to drink. When I was hungry, you fed me. It's the practical things in the kingdom that matter to God. And if you and, and our love for him is so intertwined with each other, that we've completely lost it. We think, oh, if I, if I have a, if I read the scripture, if I read the Bible for 30 minutes, if I pray for an hour, if I just spend time in the presence, then I love God.
But yet we walk around and we, we yell at our parents. We yell at our kids. We, we gossip about each other. We make accusations about. Like, how, how can we, like, how can like, that's our witness to the world right now? That's our witness to the world. And then when, when we, when we look, I really feel like God's heart is really grieved with how his children are acting right now that we're so loud.
And if we would just take six months to a year and just stop talking and just start loving on each other and just start doing kind things for the world. Jesus. Didn't say he needed, he needed a defense attorneys. He said he need witnesses.
People who are people who have witnessed that he didn't say defend, defend the scriptures. He didn't. He said, Paul said, be prepared to give an account for the hope that is in you be prepared to give an account of your story of how the master came and touched you and rescued you. He didn't say stand upon the rooftop and defend the scriptures.
He didn't say any of that because none of that is going to truly change somebody's heart. It's going to be the power of your testimony. That is the testimony of Jesus is the spirit of prophecy. And your testimony says the testimony of shame and the testimony of rejection and the testimony of failure, all of that, and how God was faithful.
You sharing that testimony is more prophetic than you will ever understand. Wow. And you don't think about it. Like, I don't think about the gift of prophecy connected to my testimony. I think about it from how can I inject positivity towards the testimony that, that person's going to walk out, but that's really powerful and actually really freeing because that means I've been walking in the prophetic for quite a few years, because I really stepped into sharing my testimony very soon after understanding the scripture that sharing your testimony and the power of your testimony to transform.
And it's an agent in which I get to glorify God, not myself, by any stretch of the imagination, I'm still less than I am still weak. I am still becoming all of those concepts, but yet there is a sense of perfection in the healing power. There is a sense of perfection in the comfort. There's a sixth sense of perfection and the fact that I have a seat at the table, no different than you, that we are worthy and called and anointed beautiful and work like he was a craft.
The fact that Jesus himself did like would work. Right. I think of this all the time. I've never actually said it really out loud is the understanding that there's construction happening all around us. There's also deconstruction happening all around us. And his power was to come and rebuild, to rebuild and to create fresh foundation for us to live within the nature and the comfort of his home.
And yet we're constantly going around destroying, comparing all of these things that are of tannic nature. And yet we think because we're not doing anything quote, unquote, wrong or sinful that we're not hurting. What is the church? What is the Christian reputation? What is all of these pieces of kingdom that isn't the invitation in and of itself?
Um, I think that that's so incredibly, um, necessary for us to stand in. It's why I created a media company because I want more people to have freedom and sharing their testimony, whether through voice or written. Yeah. Yeah. And I think that's so powerful. Um, and even with you sharing your testimony, what, what people have to understand is when you share your testimony or a testimony of something, God has done that you've seen, what you're literally doing is you're sharing some, you're sharing a time where Jesus manifested himself and it's giving that person.
That's hearing that permission to say, God, now do it again. Yeah, you did it for that person. Now that means that you can do it for me and that you will do it for me, you know? And so every time that you declare your testimony, your, your life story, every time you declared, that's not the totality of what the, all the prophetic is, but it's such a powerful thing.
You know? Um, every time you declare that you release, you release crematorial power into someone's life and you give them permission to believe God for them to say, God, do it again. You did it for Tamra. God do it for. I also think that there's a component of, of hindsight being 2020, right. And, and people so often think that like, God's never been there for me.
There's anger too. Right. There's anger associated to the Akron. God didn't show up for me that he showed up for her. He showed up for him. And there's, there's this component of, well, I'm not seeing, I'm not known. I'm not her. God didn't hear my prayers. He didn't answer it in the way we wanted it to be heard.
And when you testify, we have an opportunity to showcase that experience. It's like reading a story or even the parable, and to find yourself in that story and to find those examples of your life in that story. And you're like, wow, You're right. That actually was my story too, but I've never given God the glory in that.
I've never, I just thought it was coincidence. I just thought it was happenstance. I just thought I got to meet my husband in middle school because we were just so in love. And we only had eyes for one another and know that God testimony and so many pieces to our stories that are like that we, that we don't glorify.
There's a book by Squire. Rushnell called the God wink or when God winks and I was using. The sprays, ology God winked for a while. I said it on the podcast before, as, as my version of coincidence, because it's associated to God. It's like when you see that rainbow and after, and be like, oh my gosh, that rainbow was just for me on the perfect timing.
It's a Godwin, but this book it's super, super small it's as the fastest, like mealtime read or flight read that you could have, but associated to that is all of these massive people of fame, I guess, that you would denote as, as worthy of something. Great. And yet they go through and they share their Godwin's it's all of the times that they didn't recognize that it was God that when they gave the power back to God, rather than owning it for themselves, or even the enemy control in that.
It transformed their life. Moving forward. People like Oprah, um, people like, uh, who are in the hall of fame, people who are athletes and singers and all of this. And it just brings life to the fact that if we were better at that, if we were better at just simply being kind, because kindness creates, um, is stemmed and is cultivated through conversation rather than the ignore of the person who just opened the door for you, rather than nor of the bank teller, who just passed you money or the person at the fast food restaurant or wherever it is that you are, why don't you see people?
And actually then that's a small, small seed of kindness that can grow and flourish because if we're all meant to be seen, known and loved, you're loving in that moment. I just think it's so more powerful than we give it credit to. No, absolutely. And even going to that point where you were just talking about a couple of things, when we see someone who's holding up a sign that says.
We'll work for food, you know, please help. Instead of our hearts closing up like, oh man, what a bomb? Like get a, get a life. You know, instead of seeing that, how about we look at it through the filter of Matthew 25 when I was hungry, you fed me when I was thirsty. You gave me something to drink when you've done it to the least of these, my little ones, you've done it unto me.
So maybe, maybe if you're looking for an encounter with God, you need to go find some homeless people and encounter Jesus. Hm, so good and ask their name. This is something Gary instills in us and in the kid, he is
good. He's so good. It's what we're driving. We had just given this like, um, dollars that my, my daughter actually saves her daughter, her dollars and puts them in the car so that when we see a homeless person she can get, so she rolls down the window and she passes over this money and we're about to drive.
The light is green and it's like, everybody's going, there's a Hong corn. And, and Gary rolls down his window. He's like, brother, what's your name? And he's like me. He's like, yeah, what's your name? He was like, First off Elijah biblical reference greatness, right? Anointing on this man's life. And after we asked his name, he smiled so much bigger than when we gave him money.
Money is kind of one of those, like, I can give you this, but I can't give you my time and give you this resource, but I can't give you my energy. And so there was just, oh, it was just one of those moments. So tiny and yet so impactful. So later that day we were coming back and we went around the same corner where he was standing earlier that morning was my five hours later.
He was still standing there. We rolled down our windows and we're like, Hey, come on, scene known her. You gave him. It's dignity. That's your you're restoring royalty back to him. That's what you're teaching your kids is, is restoring royalty. And that's why you, and I've talked about this before. That's why about six months ago, the Lord really told me what was at the root of racism.
And it really is. It really is the fact that it's not about white and black. It's about the fact that what we, what I said earlier, that God put a piece of himself in every single person. He put a, he put a puzzle piece of mosaic piece of what he actually looks like in every single person. And the root of racism is the enemy trying to.
Make sure that the face and the display of God's face and the earth is incomplete because if he can Rob dignity from the black culture or any culture that has been oppressed, if he can Rob the identity and the dignity and the royalty from that culture, then the face of God is it's impossible for the face of God to be fully displayed in the earth.
That's, what's at the root of racism and that's why we have to, that's why we have to have war as a, as, as, uh, believers in the kingdom to actually look at our black brothers and sisters and anyone who's oppressed and, and the homeless and the poor and say, Hey, what's your name? I, you, I know you need to be seen.
I'm going to make sure that you're seeing today in every interaction I do need to be seen because you're royalty. You might not be walking in it yet, but you are a Royal. And so that is so powerful. Your kids are learning such a valuable lesson because dignity and royalty, royalty and dignity are such a huge thing.
Because if you don't have dignity, if you don't have internal dignity for yourself, then you just walk around with no hope. You walk around with no hope like this is, this is what life's given me. But when people like you and your family, Hey, what's your name? You know what? And my mom, I mean, I li I learned generosity from my mom and dad so early in life, sometimes it was really painful.
I mean, it was like, why are we giving a car away? Well, the Lord told us to, but even now my mom and I'll, I'll go out shopping with my mom and my mom will buy Chick-fil-A gift cards. Not for us. She'll just give them to give out to homeless people, to people that need food, $10 Chick-fil-A gift card. We don't have money, but we got gift cards here, a meal.
And so it's, but it's that thing of it's that thing of, no, everyone was given a piece of, uh, of the face of God when, before they were born, whether they w they're walking with him or not, you know, it, it, it really is. And even when, and I wanted to share this real quick, um, and, and you know, me, I'm pretty transparent, and this is a story.
This is one of those stories that I don't share very often, but it's about, um, hindsight. Um, so up until about the age of 18, I was a pretty chronic bed wetter, like every night, like every night. And, um, and. Um, I remember like when I was probably 8, 9, 10, 11 years old, um, it was bad. It wasn't like I went to bed and I woke up and it was like, oh, there's a little pee on the sheets.
It was like, I like flooded the bed. And, um, and we had plans. I had plastic sheets on my bed and what I would have to do is every night I'd have to get up in the middle of the night and I'd have to strip my bed, take it to the laundry. I'd have to get a towel, wipe the bed down, sanitize the plastic sheet again, make my bed again.
It was like a 15, 20 minute process. And every single time I woke up in the middle of the night, I was filled with shame. Just feeling like a failure. Like God, why can't I go through one night without wetting the bed? And. About it was about, I think it was about 28 years old and I was sitting in, I was praying with my mom and she was doing some, um, Theo Fosdick, uh, uh, inner healing stuff with me.
And we were praying and, and this memory just popped up. And I said, and I was like, Lord, why am I here? And I remember seeing this memory as clear as day, and I was laying in my bed. I think I was 11 years old and I woke up and the bed was just drenched in urine. And I just remember just crying and feeling so ashamed and like such a failure.
And, um, then all of a sudden I saw the Lord walk into the room and I saw him stand by my bed and he had just the kindest look on his face and, um,
He lifted up the blankets. And he said, and he said, buddy, um, he got into bed, he got into the bed with me and he said, buddy, if you, if you gotta be here, I'm going to be here with you.
And it was one of those moments that you, when I was growing up the Lord wasn't portrayed as a kind person, very legalistic, very angry. It was one of the first times in my life where I actually saw God is kind. And it's one of those moments that when I'm in a really bad spot, where if I'm struggling with depression, I'll go back to these moments to just be like, Lord, thank you for rescuing me.
You know? Cause he's just so kind, he's so much better than we've been led to believe he's so much better than we've been led to believe. And it's like when I saw that all the shame left, all the shame was gone and it was, it's just one of those times where if we can look back at our life, I love Graham Cooke.
He's a, an amazing prophet. And he says, in the moments of trial, don't ask God what he can do for you, ask God who he wants to be for you in that moment. Like, who do you want to be for me right now? How, how should I relate to you? And I just remember, I've never been able to tell that story without crying, because it's just, I remember how messed up I was.
I remember how much, I mean, I know how messed up I still am, but I remember how racked with shame and guilt. I was as a kid. And I remember how it was so hard. And then I just remember Jesus showing up in his kindness. And just, he, there was no condemnation. He's just like, I'm going to be here with you. And, and then he like, then he, like, I got out of the bed and he just started cleaning me off and he changed my bed and he tucked me back in and he kissed me and he told me he loved me.
And it was just one of those things that really transformed my view of God to be able to settle. And I asked the Lord, I said, Lord, why did I have to go through all the things I went through as a kid, I was really sick. I had asthma and allergies really bad were in the hospital three nights a week. And my brothers, both, my brothers never had issues.
I said, Lord, why did I have to go through all of this? And he very clearly spoke to me and he said, he said, buddy, if, if you didn't go through this, you would never under, you would never know the aspects and character of my nature. You understand care my aspect, the aspects of my character and nature. Like most people.
Like I understand the grace and the mercy of God in a way that some people just don't because of the things that I've gone through. But the kindness studies shown me in the mercy and the compassion that he's shown me. And so when I see people fall, when I see people in trouble, there's never a condemnation.
It's just like, Jesus just encountered them. Like you encountered me. How can I be your hands and feet in these moments to just love them in, in their mess, love them in their, in the pig pen, you know, love them in the mud, get down in the mud and say, Hey, if you got to be here, I'm going to be here with you and I'm not leaving until we get out.
It's so incredibly impactful. Thank you so much for sharing. I can bear witness to similar scenarios in my own life of being able to just have. Moment of redemption that he was there. He's been there and he's always going to be there. Um, and, and to rest assured and rest assured that it's, it's not in the dark that he doesn't exist.
Right. A lot of people think that he's a God of light, so he's only in the light, but he's actually shining light in the dark, through our situations for us to be able to still be here. And, um, that's his grace and mercy. That's his kindness, his goodness. That's his love. That's all the things that you've been speaking to this entire time, but what an impactful, like bow to the conversation, um, and in a space of humility, I love you.
I'm so proud of you. I know that there is more greatness, right? There's more greatness for us to uncover. And there things that he is showcasing to us in our life right now. And, and this is a message for everybody who's listening that like even the quote, unquote, anointed, even the ones who are shining really bright walk through fire, and God, God is still persistent in those places.
And so this is not a, uh, we figured it all out podcasts. We're in the valley site and right to the site. And there are definitely moments where we need that breath of life, breathe back into our dry bones. And that's why I say yes to this podcast and explore it with people every single day. And so, um, just continued fight.
I called you a warrior the other night and that's true. Yeah. And see, even that, like what you're saying, there is the thing that your husband was doing with you. Cause I don't feel like a warrior. It's that speaking? That's that's, that's prophetic. That's the prophesying that speaking things that are not as though they are thing.
So every time you say it, I receive it. Even if I not fully walking in it, even if I can't fully believe it, I receive it. Well, there'll be that hindsight, just like that integrity where you're like, man, that was the pinnacle. That was the moment. That was the shift. That was the word that I needed. That ignited something inside of me to.
And that's our God is a God of action. He's a God of man. He's on the move with intention every single day. And so, um, even if we're stuck in that pit, he's there, but boy does, he want us to get out and step out of the boat? Um, so I just encourage everyone. Who's listening to, uh, connect with Jonathan. You can, you can connect with him on Facebook.
He's also John David and his Instagram links and stuff are here, cannot believe this is your first podcast and Kelly who's listening live right now. I was like, no way. This is so good. I told them to you. I told you you're in for a treat is, and then the first time I've like talked about this the first time this has been recorded on a podcast.
So I look for my podcast within the next couple months. I'm going to be starting my own. So good. Y'all I'm so excited for Jonathan. Thank you so much for being here. I love you brother. All right. Yeah, absolutely. Tune in to all things been faith. We love you tag us and we'll, uh, tag you back. It's that's the part of the fun of the game is we're in community together.
There is no I in team and there was definitely no I in, in God, love you.
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